Alex - re the mag - sorry, I don't remember (I didn't buy it, having tried the 5.xx demo when 4.xx was being given away - and wasn't bothered about getting it) From memory it was on one of the PC specific (thick ones!) rather than Digit / 3D World cross platform ones - maybe check on some of the mag websites? However, once it's 'out' as a freebie am sure it'll be on one of the other mags, given time :) Maybe just nip down to your local WHS for a quick shufties. Am in town tomorrow so if I see anything, I'll post here. I wouldn't know where to start with Amapi to make some of the stuff I've made with Wings - although it's an unfair comparison, as have spent much more time with Wings - but I also can't see the point in wearing 'hair shirts' :) What type of stuff do you intend / like making? pp