P5 ain't bad as long as you are willing to have your "Fast" system run like a 486 with 16 MB of ram. I was using P5 solid since it's release until yesterday. when I finally said to myself I'd rather render than wait to load the app, wait to load a figure, wait to pose the figure, wait to add more props and other figures, and finally wait to render. Now Don't get me wrong, I'm not bashing CL. These are just the facts I see, from what my system does when I use 5. The renders did look better and firefly was the bomb. The ability to stack folders and clean up my files was a true godesnd. But the simple fact was I wasn't having fun. Now CL would ask for my system spec, OS, apps running, shoe size, mothers maiden name, and hat size. and I would give it to them with the detailed description of what I had happen. I followed thier advise and did the clean poser installs the OS installs the update every driver known to man, and added thier service releases. But 5 run twice as slow as 4Pro pack. artifacts meshes as you pose them. Still I would dread opening poser, I felt as tho I was walking in a minefield, just one mis-click and poof! So, I'm sorry CL. I tried to bear with you, I did all I could to work with you, Supported you with my money, my time, and my meeger talent. But Poser 5 has worn me down to where deleteing all my 3d stuff and just surf for porn or something. So I've gone back to what works. I've gone back to bloated folders, file name restrictions, render limitaions, walked away from a very cool render engine and a cooler and very detailed material editor. I've gone back to having fun. To those who think you have the patience, that you have the techincal abiltiy, and the stammina. I honestly wish you luck with poser5, I really do. I guess I was just not strong enough..