heyas; the new obj is created in p5 (and ppp, if i'm not mistaken) when you use the ..... ::drum roll:: INSIDIOUS EVIL GROUPING TOOL!!!!!!! :) no, really. remember in p4 when you used the grouping tool, it stuck custom geometry into your cr2? well, everybody hated that, so now it just plonks a whole new obj out into your library for the cr2 to point to.