but using PHIBuilder - and doing Hierarchy convert from File (P5 & PPP) - wouldn't recognize those 2 items (rest were ok) until I added the obj information. Is this a PHIBuilder thing or a problem with RDS/Carrera OBJ export? I actually developed the crane character in Autocad2k so can manually do something different if that helps. If I import the prop - crane - all the material and groups are recognized; just in case that means anything... BTW, thank you for your help as my client is biting at bit to manipulate the crane for a training cd.