Here goes...I stumbled upon this site a few months ago, and since I've always loved computer generated art, I became addicted to this site. I'm asking this in the Poser forum, since this is the area I view the most.
I had purchased Photoshop 7 for my daughter, who didn't have the patience to learn it, so I've now inherited it. I've been playing around with it and noticed that this is one of the programs, along with Poser, that all of you use.
Anyway, to make a long post shorter (sorry), since I am a newbie when it comes to creating art of this type, would you suggest Poser 4 or Poser 5, and what other programs would I need to purchase to get myself started?
I really admire some of the renders I have seen and would like to try my hand at this. I realize that most of you have been doing this a long time and are very good at it, and I'm not expecting miracles, but I suppose a hobby has to start somewhere.
Thank you for any advice you care to give. =)

Not laughing here. We all have to start somewhere. IMO, you may be better starting with Poser 4, simply because it's not percieved as having such a steep learning curve as P5. Sure, it's quirky in its own lovely way, but generally, most of the bugs have been squished - or there's a work round for the ones which remain. You can pretty much create any (well, most of) the images you have seen with Photoshop and Poser4 - and some patience, time and imagination. There will be other programs you may need to grab as time goes by (UVMapper and Objaction Mover, most likely) but I suggest getting to grips with some of the basics of Poser first. Ask any questions you think of, and you'll get an answer. Welcome to the madhouse. :)

Personally i'd get Poser 4 & Pro Pack, Later down the line you'll probably start making your own stuff for use in poser and find that pro pack can speed up alot of the little tasks in poser. Another Benifit of Pro Pack is that you can see mulitpul camera views at once rather then just one, and work in the different ones without having to go below, switch cameras and wait for it to process it. There is a demo of the Poser Pro Pack at the curiouslabs website that you can download and try. It lets you see all the features in the program. Best to try before you buy. Sadly they don't have any demo version of poser 5, one thing thats detoured me from getting it. Perhaps in the future they will get a Poser 5 demo out (but im not holding my breath for it) so those of us who like to see upfront and personal how the program works we can. One other Small thing too, upgrading from the Poser Pro Pack is cheeper then upgrading from poser 4 to poser 5 so if you deside to later on it will save you a little money there. Poser Pro Pack can also read compressed files, I've failed to be able to get Poser 4 to read any so im pretty much feeling that it can't be done. So Poser Pro Pack to me seems the better investment, More compatability with recent marketplace items, cheeper to upgrade, more functions then poser 4. Just my thoughts anyhow.

Yes, I agree with SamTherapy, I use Vue d'Esprit, UV Mapper, Corel PhotoPaint, Poser 4, Pro and Poser 5, but mostly Poser 4, Bryce and the PhiBuilder. The PhiBuilder is to help me with making objects poseable. Lots and lots of patience, time and you will get it...welcome to Poser and what ever else you get. You will love it. Sharen

thats one reason i like poser pro pack vs. poser 4, cuts out alotta manual editing that you had to do before with a external editor, and is simpler to use a pre existing joint structure and modify the joint structure in the setup room. also cuts out alot of frustration trying to get the joint setup 'juuust right' when moving the end points. Kinda like setting up a joint system for halflife models in milkshape3d, simple and easy.

I'm a P5 junkie, but only because I started with P4 and learned the basics there. Pro-Pack has some nice extras too. A lot depends on how deep you want to get into it. Using other peoples models to produce pretty pictures (my favorite) means Poser 4. If you want to build your own models and add bones for posing, I'd get P4 and Pro-Pack. P5 does have improvements over the P4/Pro-Pack combination. Better material handling and file management are the best. It also comes with it's own little set of problems and complexities. For a newbie: P4. And when Daz Studio becomes available, well, we'll all be trying that first thing.

Argh! I meant P4 Pro Pack. Apologies.

I would have to agree with all of the above to some degree. I would also recommend that "newbies" stay clear of P5, it is too buggy at it's current stage. In fact, it may sour your taste for Poser altogether. What little that is superior about P5 will go unnoticed if you have not used a previous version. In general, the bugs and work-arounds will confuse you and drive you insane. Daz is about to release their "Poserish" software, if you can wait. Otherwise P4, with or without the ProPack, will take you far and is probably a decent first step into 3D graphics. If you are looking for "modeling" software at a decent price, Rhino would be a suggestion. Take the time to do the research and find the app that fits your needs and budget. Best of luck

I only have Poser 4 and I love it. I see no reason yet to get Poser 5 and would not tell some one new to Poser to get 5, I am unsure about Pro Pack cause well I have never used it lol. I use mainly Poser, Paint Shop Pro and PhotoShop, and use UV Mapper a lot as well. But to start I would say get Poser 4 play with it a lot then run over to DAZ and get some of their things like Victoria, and Mike cause there are so many things out there for them, and I feel they are a lot better then the people that come with Poser 4. And read many tutorials, always feel free to ask questions and play with Poser a Lot. Hope this helps.

I agree, start with Poser 4. Terragen is a good freeware program that does fantastic background scenes which can be used in Poser. When you get better, you might want to move to Bryce 5. You'll know when its time to get Poser 5, but at this stage, I'd say P5 would be unnecessary.

Kinda like setting up a joint system for halflife models in milkshape3d, simple and easy. I thought I was the only one who saw the similarity ....

Attached Link: http://www.curiouslabs.com/

Before you seriously consider Poser 5, you might want to look at your computer hardware to see if it is up to the task. Generally speaking, and older computer might be challenged. That alone could convince you to buy Poser 4. I've provided the link to the Curious Labs web site where you can read the product descriptions and come up with your own conclusions. Poser Pro Pack is only of interest if you have very specific needs. I would hazard a guess that the newbie won't see any need for Poser Pro Pack. I didn't and still don't. Now, if you're a techno-geek like me, you might find Poser 5 of interest. I just had to have it myself. However, after a few weeks or months, I find myself using Poser 4 more and ignoring Poser 5. Some of that is due to my older computer. I really would need to buy a newer computer to make Poser 5 more practical. The other reason is the learning difficulty posed by an unhelpful manual, and the apparent lack of the type of tutorials that would demystify some of the more compiicated Poser 5 features. I will admit I can be a slow learner at times.

Hi Arabesque and welcome :) I started with Bryce 4....and then fell in love with the "look" of the images created by Vue d'Esprit. Both of these are environment generating software for the most part, although you can do some modeling (some like Wappen make amazing things in Bryce). I held off purchasing Poser because my initial impression was that all it was good for was creating "nekkid people" :) But you can only do so many landscapes before you decide they need characters! I ended up getting Poser 5. So, I'm one of those "newbies" that jumped in feet first to Poser 5 :) It probably doesn't drive me crazy, because I have nothing to compare with, having not used Poser 4 :) As rogergordian noted, make sure your system can handle it if you go the Poser 5 route. It seems to work best in XP with at least a 1.7 ghz processor and 512 mb of ram. I say that, because that's what I've got :) Curious Labs I think still has the bundle special of Poser 4 and Vue d'Esprit for about the same price as Poser 5 by itself! If I was starting out, I think that's the route I would go!

If you've never used 3d software, I suggest P4 for its relative simplicity unless you've specifically defined a need for Pro Pack or P5 features. You'll be less likely to get discouraged. As you advance your skill, P5 or DAZ Studio would be a logical next step.

I thought I was the only one who saw the similarity .... nope Little Dragon ;), I did alotta stuff with milkshape for some games, so that jointing system in it kinda got stuck in my head heh ;).

I would recommend the Poser 4 PP bundle, because -- this is only my opinion-- I found PP more stable than Poser 4, especially in the bum map error department. Also, there are some excellent Python light paks out there, which look like they might improve rendering possibilitys considerabley and they only work in PP or 5. I do not recommend starting with 5, the learning curve is too steep to start from the bottom and the bugs don't give you a whole lot of stable on-time learning. An alternate to 4 plus PP, would be the Poser 4 Vue bundle. It does mean you have to learn two programs, but the renderer in Vue is stunning, so you could pose in Poser and render the whole thing in Vue. Emily

heyas; i'd vote for the p4 and vue. with poser, you have your figures... but no place for them to live. although there are items and products and such that are filling in that category. still, poser is not a landscape program, and vue is. plus, vue will import native poser 4 pz3 files into your scene, making the integration there rather seamless.

Vue looks like a wonderful program from what i've seen people do with it, haven't tried it myself, have the demo, just haven't gotten around to it ;) Scared_Rose does some awesome work with vue.

I'm in Arabesques's boat. Been playing with Bryce, Vue and Poser4 demos. I'm not a pen & paper artist at all, but I have a lot of patience and imagination. I will want to place models to scenes with the option of animation. So I'm leaning toward P4 and the Vue bundle. Poser5 appears to be not quite there yet. My dilemma is this...I'm into the fantacy and MMORPG genre of gaming. So many of my expected creations will not be Barbie and Ken models (no offense). So will I find myself constantly buying 3rd party models like those from DAZ and others just to get different body variations, i.e. Muscularity, hair styles, clothing, 'species'... etc. This is why I thought Poser5 would be a better choose. Unfortunately it doesn't work :) Well its buggy and not yet compatible with Vue and thats a must for me. I guess if I put enough time in either of these programs I could get what I want out of it eventually. But as a newbie, Id rather be putting more time into learning and creating curve and less time just trying to get something to work at all curve. Any comments, please...