Dodger, Hmm... render has other meanings. One renders pigfat, too, on the way to making soap. Is "hanging out spanging" anything like "hanging out in the freezer"? (I've heard the word "chill" used in a recreational way.) It is hard to type with tongue wedged in cheek, but if I'm to render gutterpunks I ought to know things like this. Also, isn't it necessary to fatten them up a bit first? Most of the ones I've seen have been mere sticks. Carolly