Sorry, Caly, I really didn't mean to challenge Vicky 3 specifically, but was referring more to the technology behind the Millennium figures which are primarily Michael 1 & 2, Victoria 1 & 2 and the Mil Kids. Victoria 3 is undeniably the most complex figure that DAZ has produced, and is visually stunningly attractive. But to achieve that degree of control, they have pushed old technology to its limits with increased polygon counts and a massive array of morphs. The result is a figure that is very cumbersome to use, especially if you have multiple figures in a scene. On the other hand, the P5 figures use SDS which requires fewer polygons to achieve the same degree of detail as a high resolution mesh and are therefore much easier to pose and manipulate within Poser. And finally, bear in mind that Poser 5 complete with figures and several clothing items for each of the 4 family members costs LESS than Victoria 3 with morphs, textures, and a few clothing items. So when the question is whether someone should invest in Poser 5 versus ProPack, I think the decision is clearly in favor of P5. As far as my comments about the figures goes I guess I am just getting tired of people taking every opportunity to bash Poser and Praise DAZ when neither has anything to do with the subject. The Poser 5 figures are adequate for many people and are technically superior because they use technically superior technology. And yes they have problems, but the problems can all be fixed with morphs because the mesh itself is very stable. On the other hand, the problems with Michael and Victoria cannot be fixed with morphs because they are integrated in the mesh. My comments are not intended to discourage anyone from buying DAZ figures or even to suggest that Don and Judy can replace them, but I do wish to defend Poser from being unfairly attacked by somewhat biased people who can't see beyond the next breast morph. I may not be a V3 fan, but I VERY anxiously await Michael 3! ;-)