Charlie Brown, thanks. Yeah, maybe I should scan an actual pallet and map it to a "sheet of glass" and try bump maps for the paint blobs, bump maps have never been good to me but I'll try it. With cofee can I want those ridges they have around the middle and lips at the top and bottom... I tried joining multiple turuses that were fattened into open cylenders but it didn't look right, I should just try lathing it now that I just got the software. RayDream3D (thier new "consumer product") and 4DVision Sculpture (a NURBS app) just came in the mail but they are pretty overwhelming to me, so far all I've managed to do is lath some wine glasses. The 4DVision app has "ribbon" Nurbs objects that look like they would be perfect for making hair, and the documentation says you can conform "drape" the Nurbs objects to imported mesh objects. I wish there was a tutorial to get me started sculpting hair! Or a tutorial for just where to start in modeling, for under $100 total I manageged to purchase legal copies of Amorphium, Raydream3D, and 4DVision Sculptor, but I just don't even know where to start... I've made the wine glasses, some plates, some morphs in Amorphium, but I'm having trouble even conceptualizing complex objects let alone hair. In anycase, everything is back burner as my sudden move to Canada is four weeks a way now. Pardon me for prattling on here.