Arcady, Thanks for compiling those links. I'll go look right now. Don't toss the first face you made, I like it more than the second, very human, real. I was distracted on the second figure by the oiled up skin and the kind of perfectness of it... the first face would go with a short legged long waisted physic and be a great "portrait". Now to all those images you culled for me! Thank you all, you are tipping me in the direction I DON'T want to go since it will make me poorer but I really apreciate the detailed information you are providing to help me decide. P.S. Thank you all for not bashing my awefull spelling. I grew up speaking english at home but taught myself how to read and write it, I grew up going to French Language Parochial school in Quebec. There are non-english speakers around here who put me to shame with thier nearly flawless English (for example dzart) and people I respect for thier courage to just make themselves understood like Leeroy5 (whoes english is much better than he realizes). But Renderosity really is a safe haven for all us dsylexics and English as a second (third? fourth?) langue typers.