Very impressive test, ronstuff. I have to say in defence of poser 5 (even if I'm not a P5 user) that it was certainly an ambitious attempt to push the envelope, while staying within the traditional poser price-range. Despite all the complaints, for those who do have it running, there's evidently a lot of advantages. It's not the first time I've heard comments like 'it'd be a real shock to "drop back" from some of the Poser 5 capabilities'. 'DAZ is going to provide the functionality of Poser 4 for free' Well.... not quite. They may provide some of the capabilities, but if you can't save your work, it's not exactly up there with Poser. Not that I'm complaining. I don't expect to get it all free. DAZ want people to beta-test for them, and get them 'psyched up' to buy the program, but they're being quite open about it. They aren't stupid enough to let themselves in for the same criticism as CL did, ie. 'We're all unpaid beta-testers' So it follows that they must have a lot of confidence in it. If it was a turkey, they sure wouldn't be offering it for a free test-drive! 'But there's no camera trackball' Great! After working with 'real' 3d apps that use an arc system instead of Toytown controls, I always dread opening up poser and seeing that awful UI. Take it from me, spit. If DS uses an arc, you'll get used to it in about 10 seconds and never look back. Let's all convene in 6 months and see how we feel. LOL. mac