you are all so helpful.. 1. I lived in St Louis all my life... so yes, I know what it is supossed to look like... 2. After seeing ELECTROGLYPH's ARCH that he made for me, I thought of the cyllender/cone thingy... BUT, his only needed stretching... and poof... good enough for me for now.. it's good to see all the different techniques people offered here.. it shows a sense of community.. AND understanding that not everyone is going to be as handy at one way of doing it or other...or that it might be easier for a person to imagine/do it one of the various ways proposed... keep up the helpful info like this... and I'll be a master in no-time... (master of World Web Wabbits?)<--- floppy plug in futile attempt at humor I'm using Glyph's arch at the moment... i created the brick and groute sections for the coping... buit hit a wall.. i need to crop the pieces at a 45 degree angle with a groute line at same... and made all 400 brick and groute are as neutrals, in several groups... it's being stubborn, in that i gotta ungroup the entire thing, select each piece... and set to positive,,, in order to crop it with a negetive... i may just redo the coping from scratch... but would like to avoid that...kay-sera-sera... here's what i got so far... (it will undergo MANY transformations as I find my limits and explorations...)