Okay, I'm still working on it. I've managed to change the color to a good shade of blue. The caustic is still giving me a small amount of grief (now I know why they are called "caustics") I'm going to try the idea of the spotlights on the sub and wreck (I'm really thinking of a spotlight from the sub to the wreck) Believe it or not, I have a light in the sub. Why it isn't showing up, I don't know. I figured this scene to be in fairly deep water but if I wouldn't use the caustic, how would I show it to be in water? (my bubbles look sooo fake) I'll post what I've done so far once I've worked on it a bit more (maybe tomorrow night, today was a bear and I'm really...well, you know). I'm still looking for some fish, So far the only one I found in the bryce freebies looks too cartoonish. I have found some 3ds files of sharks and such, got a real nice seahorse also. Is there a way for bryce5 to open up a 3dsmax file? everytime I try I get an error message (not valid format or some such) Sorry to ramble on. Thanks for all your help Herne