I've just bought myself a new car, it's a Renault Kangoo Trekka 4x4, last years model. In other words a van with seats, but what seats they are, it's almost like sitting on a sofa. @Roch222, did you mean 39 years?, although I think expressing them as tears is more appropriate to a lot of us.........lol 8) And I'm 42 so I've shed more tears than you or Ang. 8) Catlin