You're right, evr. I just can't figure out the idiot values in poser and I'm fed up rendering every 20 seconds to see what effect each change has. I have a bad feeling I'm trying to get poser to do something it can't. As a photographer, I expect lights to follow certain rules, but poser lights have their own rules. igohigh, Thanks. I looked at geep's tute (after the half hour it took to load. LOL.), but it didn't tell me anything I didn't already know. I'm afraid I'm going to have to work with the light positions instead of Angle/Distance. Ah well, back to the grind. mac