AMD 1.1GHz 1GB Ram Win2K 366 seconds (bucket size left at default) It's a 1GHz overclocked to 1.1, 100 bus overclocked to 133, SDRAM. There is clearly variation on AMD Win2K systems too. I'm one of those who's abandoned Loser5 due to its speed (across the baord not just rendering which I'd expected would be slow). I'd conjected that memory bus speeds might be significant, after all Poser hammers the memory subsystem something wild. Do those people with slower times than others with same CPU/amount of memory/OS also have slower memory? BTW, milamber has the right idea splitting AMD and P4 out separately. Intel P4 GHz'ises are weaklings compared with those of PIII and AMD. Matrox has done much analysis for their new digital video line, and rate a P4 1.8GHz as equvalent to a PIII 1GHz for pure CPU rendering times. So a 1 = 1.5 ratio of P4 to AMD GHz #'s seems reasonable (note that's AMD GHz not to be confused with their chip numbers - don't you love Prod Mktg guys ... ;-) lb