Well as per my other message (Vu4 + Panther = Bryce 5) You cant even install Vue4 on OSX 10.3 as the installer quits immediately. Likely, (as was implied at the Apple WWDC) e-on could have avoided these issues had they developed Vue for Mac using Apple's well documented development guidelines. It does not mean that you won't have problems, but they usually won't be to this major of a scale. I am just about to buy a new mac too, that will come with 10.3, and new macs are usually not able to run OS versions older then what is pre installed. This is just a shame and makes me feel like I wasted my money. Oh well, Back to bryce and Carrara3... -Paul