Lady Cherry, I'm not exactly sure why you're wanting to discuss this in a public forum, and why you're publicly posting my private communications to you. This is really an issue best handled via email or IM between you and I. That said, I will explain for a final time as far as I feel I can or should in a public space: First of all, Lady Cherry and Rendervisions is already back in the Web Ring, as we would like to give her the benefit of the doubt. That was even before I had seen this thread this morning; in my original message (as we all know) I invited her to rejoin. But the numbers on her site's rise to the #2 spot in the Web Ring (over a matter of a few weeks) were much, much different from every other site in the Top 15. Not to mention that those other top sites had been a part of the Web Ring for at the very least a year, and in most cases much longer. Rendervisions joined the Web Ring in Feb 03. One's standing in our Web Ring is based on 3 factors, each assigned a different 'weight'. The higher one's total weight, the higher in the Web Ring she'll appear. I'm not going to share those numbers with everyone here. Though her numbers were significantly, obviously, and oddly out-of-line with every other site in the Top 15, not to mention on down the list. Most of the skewed activity was recent, reflecting the meteoric rise to the top. Is it possible for those numbers to be arrived at legitimately? Of course...Is it likely?...Not very. Her site is not the only one that's been in the Web Ring for a long time, yet it's the only one to skyrocket to the top in just a matter of weeks. We believe they manipulated their web ring position. But, we also wanted to give them a chance to start over -- instead of just booting them altogether. Hope that helps clear it up. thanks, --Asher Renderosity Admin