"Even if Daz Studio is just a render engine, So is Renderman and Mentalray for Maya. They sure out render Poser if you can figure out how to use them. I am hoping Daz studio will include Global illumination in their renderer. Poser render engines are really bad including FireFly." It takes a LOT of support from the application to make Renderman useful... just slapping the Renderman renderer on something isn't going to dramatically change anything about what you wind up with unless the application can feed geometry and materials to it usefully. The more you work with something like Mental Ray the more you realize that Firefly has a lot of power and (gasp) a decent UI to get at it... the wiring system in the shader room for example is actually pretty cool :) What is interesting is seeing how many peopel are confused into thinking that D|S supporting "hardware accelleration" and "OpenGL" is going to make renders faster :) The first D|S only product that hits is going to split this market into chunks and the peices may well no longer be large enough to support the kind of grwoth we are used to.