Ming Sez: " So, since you can't afford enough programers, you don't want to hear about all the problems...just some of them. " Not exactly. Dunno how much experience you have with program development, but every major commercial program out there that isn't Open Source does it the same way... release it to a small cadre of pre-alpha experienced testers to bang out the huge and obvious bugs (trust me, you really don't want to know how many times I've had to sit through a re-install of Windows XP just to re-create a clean environment during pre-alpha testing.) Then, it goes to a wider array of folks to get a larger sample of machinery to test it out on (which cures a wider variety of not-so-nasty bugs.) Finally, it goes out to the general public, where the smallest bugs can be finessed out. Now compare that with Poser 5*, where they were pressured by EGI-Sys to push a short beta-testing program, then out to the public at large. Take a cruise through the Poser 5-related complaint threads... and that was their "finished product." (this isn't a bag on CL since they were pressured to do it, but it goes to show what would happen if you had gotten what you wanted - a push to the public of a raw and unfinished proggie.) * again, this is not a bag on Curious Labs - read the whole paragraph plz :) Xantor sez: " I didnt know microsoft even tested their products ha ha*" You'd be surprised. I prefer Linux to anything made by Microsoft, but I can tell you that even MS takes quite a bit of time and effort to test their stuff before releasing it. Microsoft's problem isn't in testing and release of apps, it's in the basic structural flaws of the OS itself, IMHO. " *If they dont put it out for "ordinary" people soon it will be on kazaa winmx and all the rest." Sure... and folks who do such a stupid thing like download it from there take their chances with trojans, backdoors, and a zillion other ways for some 13-yr. old script kiddie to own their computers. Oh, and typical virus-catchers and firewalls aren't going to catch a lot of the backdoors and trojans that the person intentionally installs. Besides, a typical download off of kazaa, winmx, e-donkey/e-mule, etc takes about 10x as long as just straight-up downloading from the DAZ server. Even BitTorrent would take much longer, assuming someone actually bothered to seed an unstable alpha proggie in the first place... To those out there humming up Kazaa now? They're certainly welcome to try, of course (the proggie costs nothing anyway), but they won't get any sympathy from DAZ when their boxes becomes someone else's property, or it chokes to death and takes all the data with it (shrug.) /P