I will render a new pic of the male, I did a quick one last night to see if the texture map I've been laborously working on for the Male would fit this guy. And yes it does! I really should render one of him with hair instead of bald, he'd be more presentable. Veth, perhaps we should try to talk Traveler into converting some of his morphs for those of us who are modeling impaired. I have some favorite morphs that I use on the male but no way to transfer them to the new fellow. As for the lady above, as I said on the male, the increase in polygons, ect., does great for close up facial renders. Now, if you could combine this figure with Pam's new mapping.... Liz Pope Dreamspinner Inc.