Yes you are both correct, Jeff I try to keep the vertice count low untill I am done with the complete model. It makes it much easier for me to attach teeth and so forth and make my changes, unfortunately I am running on a PIII 450mhz with an Oxygen-VX1 and 256mg of RAM. when I get too many poly counts in the vertex room, It makes it hell for me to model. My systems boggles down badly, but so far I did give it a test of a multires subdivide and the facets maintained nicely, it even gave it a muscled look. Thanks for commenting guys Love and Peace Serge