Discussions went on about vicki & Mike being run through the mangler and incorporated into the Face Room while P5 was under development, but CL wanted so much money for the work that DAZ backed out and refused to pay that much. Okay, it costs a fair amount of time to set it all up, but one does wonder whether CL would have been better served of a more friendly attitude at the time. Full compatibility with the Milfigures would have opened things up more for CL and maybe they wouldn't have run straight into the wall soon after P5's release and keeled over. After all, the development of Judy etc was so rushed and so unfinished that the P5 figures simply never got the breakthrough acceptance they could have had. They never had a chance to compete with Vicki et al. The Face Room thing was part of the reason that DAZ decided to go their own way, refuse to support P5 and develop DAZ Studio, you can be sure. :] Fish