Forum: Poser - OFFICIAL


Subject: CHANGE OF RULES FOR FERGUSON'S "ROMANCE LONG AGO" CONTEST

Pen_Is_Envy opened this issue on Jun 13, 2004 ยท 58 posts


Armorbeast posted Sun, 27 June 2004 at 4:23 AM

Well I waited a bit to reply because I originally brought up the issue of the illegality of the requirement that Cimerones products had to be used to enter this contest...it may not have been by intent but without question to require Cimerones products be used did violate the law I knew without question because if you didn't have one of her products you couldn't enter-thus to enter you had to buy one of her products.For members who said well if you don't want to buy you don't have to enter...well thats the point,as soon as you made that statement you were acknowledging the illegality of this requirement...and it worked as we see an admission that Cimerones sales increased quite a bit as a result.Federal law itself requires that no purchase may be required to enter a contest and the fed has determined by in large to recognize what the states decide on their own beyond that. When I spoke with Cimerone about this she assured me that she had spoken with an attourney who told her it was legal and even why it was legal...unfortunately this proved to be misleading.Unless an attourney knows every law in every state,county or community in the U.S. they cannot make such an assumption...and yet here they did and two people who believed they were within the law find that in fact they were violating it. I do not say this to attack Fergusen or Cimerone...I say it because I have heard this so many times and had this same argument so many times.In every case someone who believes they know the law makes assumptions and tells you its ok to make a Ford Thunderbird prop for sale or a Marilyn Monroe character...wrong,it is 100% illegal to do so everywhere in the U.S. without the authorized approval of the product copyright holder or the person/estate of the person involved.You may make a Fyord Thunderhawk that looks almost like a Ford Thunderbird and be safe...you may make a character that everyone knows represents Marilyn but isn't an exact copy and uses a variation on her name like Mary Ann Marlows.The issue is when you sell these products...if the use of a name or likeness is used to sell a product then the person you've elected to infringe upon can take you to the cleaners-if its a freebie your ok.Answer then is to make the character or product free and find a way to sell accesories that go with it that aren't copyrighted. These are common sense issues...its like when someone on another site pointed out that Cimerone and Fergusen had this idea together before the contest was posted-they pointed out (before the topic was deleted by an overzealous admin)that this would constitute conspiracy and fraud-in truth if they did communicate about this beforehand and agreed to make the requirement that her product "must" be used,it would indeed constitute both.I don't think that happened...but these contests are going to be launched more frequently and aren't being monitored to protect members.If something goes wrong then all hell breaks loose in the forums afterward...I don't see why these matters will only be addressed "after" they erupt,these are generally cut and dry issues that could be addressed very simply and put in the TOS as recognized legal infringements of copyrights or free trade-even if everyone is not familiar with the law or the TOS,there are enough that are who could point to the possible TOS violation to help you. I am so glad that this matter was resolved early at the beginning of the contest rather than allow others to begin raising objections during the month that finally erupt in the forums and cause permanent rifts between friends that may be divided on the matter like it did during the BMO situation.I will have my own contest going next month honoring Kozaburo where we require you must use his hair products...but they're all free and I already checked to make sure its 100% legal since no required purchase to enter is being made.The funny thing is,I could ask that a donation be made to Koz,to me or a worthy cause and it be 100% legal...if you want to get around the law there are dozens of ways to do it legally as in Cimerone having a large number of freebies that people could have used-most people would still have bought items from her store,but a diverse number of freebies would have allowed anyone to enter and so the requirement would have been legal unless it was proven you discriminated against entrants that used the freebies.But at rosity she only had one freebie and there was no mention as to where others were that might be used...thus,it could be argued that people had to find ways to use that freebie in images where it made no sense and thus they were discriminated against in the final judging...there have indeed been contests where this was argued and the plaintiffs were victorious. So think...if we within this community allow violations to take place in regards to copyrighted material,then we can never hope to take legal action against people who steal the fruits of your hard earned labor.You can't argue that someone is giving your product away free on Kazaa if you illegally used a copyrighted product name without permission to make it...and if you obey the law,you fall victim because so many others don't and the community itself may in fact stand against you...we love our freedoms and don't want them infringed upon even if its for the common good,its always an interesting argument lol. And again,nothing against Fergusen or Cimerone is implied...just for a change someone in a better position to address the issue and who did so through the correct means has proven me right-in other csses I was correct but it was an argument among members and I was shouted down.I don't make issues to harm anyone,I only have good intent and when I'm right and know I'm right...its rough to be shouted down by a mob or have it erupt into flaming in these forums.So for once I feel vindicated and that maybe I prevented these two from violating laws that they were misled into believing they were not.Others will follow and unlike Cimerone and Fergusen,some of these people will truly be out to rip you off...be careful ok and hope this contest goes very well for Cimerone and Fergusen:)

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