An interesting point. just to clarify - are you using the word "chaos" in a mathematical sense? "Chaos = A dynamical system that has a sensitive dependence on its initial conditions." regarding the last part of your response, is it fair to say that if something has infinite detail, that it is chaotic? Surely, given infinite time & the desire, the order can be ultimately worked out? regardless (of this longwinded approach), the fact that you know the formula indicates that detail follows a fixed rule & therefore can be nothing but ordered. I must admit to not being aware of the detailed mathematics behind fractals, so please set me straight if i'm confusing the issue. Thanks GDV