Ok Len I reread all that had bugged me before and I apologize for saying it was your fault, as it was more the narrow minded outlook of others. It just riles me something rotten when I hear these folks bad mouth our forum, especially when they never come in here and they don't know the folk's here, and then go on to proclaim that their's is the better forum with nicer people. Anyway, I think your system is even more interesting having seen your latest examples and I still want to play. 8) Catlin