True PJF but it doesn't "reflect" it back into the scene far enough. The falloff is way too short. Another point is yes I could probably reduce the number of lights needed but not sure I would get the same effect and probably more banding (which you can't see in these renders). Don't get me wrong, I like TA a lot it just doesn't do enough of what I want. I want light to bounce several times and not just in certain circumstances like you thread that you posted some time ago (which I have yet to reproduce). I'll be putting up a render soon of the tube light with a lot fewer lights and soft shadows and compare it to the above.