I wouldn't think of slapping you FyreSpiryt. I am inviting all the input I can get! I appricate your viewpoint and I agree with you that it's dark. I used StefyZZ's Asia lights and didn't modify them at all. I think it made a dramatic difference by itself. I need to really dig into it. It really helps when I see improvement! And it helps to be encouraged by others as well. Thanks! I've passed by the book you mentioned several times mainly from cost. But I do hear and see it mentioned alot. Gonna have to breakdown and get it I think. I've also been playing around with rendering it in black and white. Sometimes that gives it more realism than the color does. I did do one with the bump map attached to the bump node of the skin. She looked like one of the body husks found in Pompei. Pretty wicked! Anyway, thanks again for your input. It's always welcome! Nebula