I know you weren't being mean, Doug! I just thought it was funny, and text doesn't convey humor or sarcasm very well! Thanks for the comments, everyone... Oh yeah, AS... the "crinkley elbow" material is my secret weapon. DAZ keeps harassing me for the secrets of the Crinkley Elbow, but I won't give in... unless they send me a demo or something... yeah.. a demo...... Bryce 9 demo would rule...