Petshoo, I am far from disappointed with carrara , I think it is a great application and far from being shallow. I just wanted to know exactly what czarnyrobert was meaning as I was going to try a scene similar to his . (I like his work very much.) Carrara users can produce some great results. I like it that you can model almost anything in Carrara then render it with great results. Not to pick on Vue but the modeling isn't as strong, you would sort of need to model complex things in other programs.