"I've also used virtual ram before and in windows you can exceed more than 2 gig by simply creating another virtual memory buffer. MAX renders far more complicated scenes without hitting 2 gig memory walls." No matter how many vm buffers you have, windows, itself, still doesn't allow and individual program running to use more than 2GB. It's not exceedable. Indeed, if you have more than 4GB or VM, the amount over that is wasted and unused. This applies to any windows system at present except the 64 bit server -- which can handle 8GB of VM per program if it is run on a 64-bit processor natively. 3DS Max creates it's own buffers, much like Photoshop does, and utilizes a compression algorithm for handling bitmap images and meshes when handng them off to the processor. Improvements can be made, certainly. You note starting off that Poser cannot exceed 2GB. This is true, and a few of us have noted why. Poser does indeed use VM. Up to 2GB as allowed by the operating system. "What also bugs me is the abhorent lack of error messages when locking up. " I agree, and I really like Poser. Despite some notes earlier otherwise, the only program easily available that allows you to do what Poser does is D|S. (You can't pose natively in Vue) A separate buffer creatd by the program that is used prior to the use of the windows system would help -- but it would also drive the space usage up a lot. Since Poser uses files in their uncompressed and flat state (and from your description above, you're actually using close to 650MB in just figures+cr2's, even with the optimizations) already, there's some risk there. "I am also thoroughly convinced that FireFly uses double the ram of P4 renderer by handing the models off to FF to render. These models are probaly duplicated when packaged and sent to the other renderer. " I have to agree with CL on this one myself -- if it did dupe the object in handling, you'd see a fourfold increase in memory handling at time of rendering, and there isn't one. This is what is killer about hardware assisted rendering, as it does sorta require a doubling of things since it's passed simultaneously in most cases to CPU and GPU. Poser does have limitations. It is still ultimately designed for only a few figures at a time, and the greater community for it has certainly made all sorts of hacks (MAT files use more RAM, incidentally, and for no good reason that I can find) that make it easier to use. Then again, we're not dealing with 5,000 rampaging orcs. Having done a scene with 60 of the little DAZ gremlins, an ichiro, a Koshini, and some really high poly bryce terrains, I definitely feel for you. Oh yeah, definitely. My suggestions are going to be get rid of the CR2's whenever possible (ie, just use the raw objects exported after posing), and check the materials for unpinned nodes (which add overhead). After that, it's going to depend on your render settings -- and I'd go into firefly, not P4, for it.

thou and I, my friend, can, in the most flunkey world, make, each of us, one non-flunkey, one hero, if we like: that will be two heroes to begin with. (Carlyle)