I've got no beef with you petshoo or most Vue users. But it's really annoying for someone to post "Vue rules the 3D World" in a Bryce Forum. Actually, I call it just plain rude. But being rude in return is not the answer either. So I'll apologize for that. You're certainly entitled to think Vue noises are better - since I can only go by the Vue images posted and the reputation of these two guys, I still stand by what I said. I'm sure you'd know if it was a hybrid CD - Vue's Store page seems to indicate otherwise. As I said, I haven't been able to get the Vue demos to work on my Mac machine and I don't buy apps that I don't know will work. I'm glad your Mac version works on your machine. But I've never has any version of Bryce not work on any machine or OS. And as DAZ moves forward (hopefully) with Bryce development these Vue/Poser vs Bryce/D|S fights are probably just going to get a lot worse. Thanks for your response; Dan