I was using 3d Max as an example; fls13 didn't say what program he was using. My point is that if somebody is using a high-end program, then fine, more power to them. But I don't appreciate being chided about "developing real 3D skills" just because I prefer to use Poser and Daz3D models. Actually, Maxxmodelz, I'd be interested in hearing your perspective as a 3DsMax user, concerning the Poser models. Can you customize the models in Max, or do you use them as is? Do you find the P5 models useful for anything? (I haven't.)