"If you really hate Poser that much (and you obviously do) ??? What did I say to warrant this? I don't hate Poser, I love it. I believe that's borne out in posts I've made way long before P5 came out. And even after it came out I was upbeat and tried to help. I, along with a CL employee, figured out the problem with the %^@* characters in library palettes. Excuse me, but I refuse to be a CL suck-up and will continue to point out problems (NOT issues). And I firmly believe my "carping" has helped CL develope a better, more stable program. Kissing butt and saying "everything is so fantastic" doesn't help when things are wrong. I guess the whole Poser world is different from the rest of the world. You know, the world in which people expect improvements in new software? I guess to fit in in the Poser world, you just have to accept whatever is offered. Sorry, but I suppose I ain't going to fit in. And Carolly, if you love Poser so much, why upgrade? Just keep what you have, it's perfect isn't it?