Ben Dover, I am sure you mean well, but IMHO the information above your last post was already rich, generous and excellent (including your suggestion). Much of it refered to the Poser Manual with chapters given, which does not require the person to "flounder around" at all. And what did you/we receive so far for our generosity? a scolding from a newbie in post 18. My opinion is that the person coming in here, so far, is a pure "taker" and has not ante'd up an ounce of effort so far, except for the ability to type in exclamation marks. The person expresses respect for the artists here in the first post, but does not demonstrate that respect through actions. The person has, however, deonstrated the willingness and ability to intimidate and manipulate through 'hurt feelings' that the plate they were handed their request on was not gold plated. Thats my considered opinion. ::::: Opera :::::