Okay guys, it's real simple here: If you're going to sell something for a specific tool, make sure it looks decent in the tool you're selling it for. Anything else is misleading advertising, period. (Hiya Kolschey! Don't take this personal, but...) Poser merchants aren't Ford, they're not GM, and they're not Daimler-Chrysler - they don't have the same leeway that makers of high-priced durable goods have. Also, even on their most outrageous-claimed commercials, you'll see a shedload of disclaimers somewhere in there stating that the product they're showing off includes special-order or premium packages that are available (at a higher price) to the potential customer. I somehow fail to see the same disclaimers in a lot of the high-end CG-rendered promo images here. You'll also notice that the nanosecond any of those big boys get caught advertising a feature that their product isn't capable of will usually be met with strong and loud criticism from nearly every watchdog organization on the planet, as well as a tidy but unrelenting reports of same on the evening news. (...and Lord help you if you get caught putting out a misleading ad in the UK...) Jim Burton made a ton of sense up there... I strongly suggest that anyone who claims to be a merchant take the time to soak his words in. If poser merchants don't have the skills to make something look presentable under a decent set of available Poser lights and Firefly, then perhaps they shouldn't be selling anything for Poser? Either a merchant is a professional, or a merchant is not. Those wanting to reach Jim's level of longevity, stature, and sales record would do well to heed his advice. --- There are some other concerns which I think I may be able to address: "Maybe we are forgetting that we don't all use the same graphics card, or display resolution. What I render on my computer probably looks totally different on someone else's, even using the default Poser lights." True, but a promo image will, if honestly presented and rendered under a communally-accessible light set, look the same on my monitors at home via website before I buy the thing as they should on those same monitors via completed render while I'm using the product. OpenGL will certainly alter that a bit, but not by a noticeable difference... and not enough to justify using a $4500 program to help fudge the promo image. "Im sorry BUT if I see a poor render one that does NOT SHOW OFF THE WORK. My tendency is to think the quality of work is inferior" I agree - but if it requires something outside of Poser to make that happen, then maybe the merch should sell it to someone other than Poser users? "would'nt work with the enviroments I work on.. which btw do ship with lightsets that match the renders we promo." Makes perfect sense though... you're supplying customers with the means to match the promo render results, no? If nothing else, that's a damned good idea (and one that used to be implemented a lot)... provide the light set you used in the promo render. Can't be too hard to save and package a custom light set, can it? " when I hear: "i am not an artist cut me some slack" that implies Do all of the work for me so i dont have to do anything at all to get my desired results..." OMG! Dude - this is POSER! lmao (sorry - had to.) Seriously though, what exactly d'ya think the RMP demographic consists of? It's a huge number of folks who don't have the time, patience, or (let's be honest here, 'cause I'm one of 'em in this category - ) talent to pull off all this stuff by themselves - otherwise we'd all be over at CGTalk, bragging on our latest and greatest stuff, like, say, a '1325-man-hours-and-counting!' render of a homemade meshed, rigged, and textured cockroach crawling across a homemade meshed and textured tabletop laden with homemade meshed and textured dinner clutter. /P