'im trying to bow out of this thread peacefully and without stepping on any more toes but you are not making it easy for me with a statement like that' Gabriel, you're not stepping on my toes. You disagree. Fine, I have no problem with that. Everyone sees things differently. T'would be boring otherwise. 'daz is the only company capable of producing something like V3' I didn't say that, and although you may have taken that as my meaning, it wasn't. You may be right that there's still room for individual creators to break in with a major figure, but it's becoming more and more difficult. Apart from the development resources, DAZ has the clout to push a major figure and get it supported, which makes all the difference. Doesn't matter whether it's people buying into the hype or not (I tend to agree with you there), it still happens, and very few sites can make it happen. Forget the scanning and realism side of it. We still have a situation where the resources and a good dev team can make the difference. Couple that with the marketing, and the competition has a hard time keeping up. If CL released P6 with J & J as add-ons, heavily marketed and sold separately at a decent price, assuming they're not half-assed figures, they'd probably sell a bundle. DAZ isn't the only company who could market a figure. But who's competing? Making a figure that uses V3's JPs isn't exactly my idea of originality. Anyway, I'm certainly no big fan of photorealism. I was a fashion photographer for 20 years, so I'm quite happy to avoid ultra-real figures in poser. But there's no doubt that it sells. mac