the person who can actually FIX V/M's problems in this area would make a fortune. Supposedly, a lot of minds have looked into it and the only way to fix the unimesh IN POSER would be to rig in a way to dial down the range of motion, and that has not been deemed a good trade-off. I have been sarcastic with DAZ over this in the past, but have given that up. I have come to believe it is not entirely (or even largely) their fault. "...his inner elbow is like rounded Playdoh..." that's a new one for the list. My choice of words is "bent drinking straw." ::::: Opera ::::