stealth1701, Unfortunately, I HAVE read all the messages in this thread. and I've seen these arguments come and go and come and go repeatedly. Sheep and goats, and YOU want to distinguish them with red brands on their butts because you can't tell straight horns from curly horns without a label? Why? Why does it matter??? If you need the label, anybody can sell you anything. Why is there such a crying, screeching, high-pitched whining need to be exclusive (oh, wowie)... based upon whether or not one works with the rendered image to make it closer to the artist's own vision? Ansel Adams baked many of his prints in the microwave to bring out details... does THAT make him less of an artist? (ack! postwork!!) A cheater??? That is what you are implying... and why we are peeved at this argument continuing over and over and over. It doesn't matter if it is photographers are cheaters or Poser users are cheaters or postworkers are cheaters... you are still claiming by your constant clamor for PURITY that all else falls short and is less true, less ideal, less worthy. You can take your red cloth and wind it around your own horns. Some of us refuse to be driven into the desert so that you can be pure. Oh, and the idea mentioned above of starting your own gallery at your own site is a great one. That way you can police every entry for postwork abuse and seal the blessed ones with your own mark of purity. Carolly