Newbies are fine, but there's something to be said when a site and it's new vocal members no longer cherish devotion and are actually very vocal about it. There is a great loss. Value. Kendra above says it all too well. "Some changes are not for the better." You newbies may not see it, and the folks running the site are too busy to care and most of them are actually new as well, so perhaps they themselves feel that same attitude XENOPHONZ and dialyn seem to have and probably just want to follow instructions and do what have to. *********************************************************** This site took years to build on old ideas. It may take years to fizzle with this new attitude of "I don't care or give a damn" and "me, me, me is really all that matters and as long as I am here, what do I care who leaves or who comes." A big part of this place has already died when a site is basically dependant upon it's newbies with attitude and and old lurkers who no longer participate except as forgotten clones. There's very little substance left except for what money can buy, and even that seems questionable at times according to some blathermouths.