oh well, guess we never get over it, the Fun20 is NOT to be taken seriously, and we are NOT the problem really, we dont hear those who hit the voting button before they look at the piece of work the artist has created, cause they still will keep hitting that button, cause the mod says thats a good thing to do ... but unfortenately it isn't why do those peeps hit the voting button and spam their gestures openly in the comments is what we just want to know from them, you know yourself who you are, i would love to hear their comments on this matter also, but they keep faily quiet and vote more than ever the problem with more voting is that when one doesnt have much time to comment and vote, never gets to chance to get in there, i have tried that too ... no matter how many comments you give away, they just don't comment back, and will not vote for your own 'masterpiece' to solve all this you may want to considder the possibility to get the voting system quite differently: #1. change the Hot20 into the Fun20 #2. give the artist the possibilty to disable the voting, so they will and have to chose for themselves whether they want to be there or not i really dont give a $h1t about any toplist, for if i wannabe in there, i just can upload to the artmatic gallery, most of my designs are assembled with fractals generated from that program but thats not where i feel i belong to, i do my own art which belong in the fractal category, and thats what i keep on doing we have had many discussions about the face of our community, and like one which was about the mixed media, well it flows away too, and people just upload them mixed medium images in here again, like it used to be again the biggest problem lays in the H20, and still nothing has really changed, and the discussion stays ... i wonder what they do to solve this problem, or do they have a voting system here themselves whether they want to do anything what their members suggests anyways, hope those who are addicted or committed to whether they vote or want to be voted will figure it all out and i dont see if its a good idea to get old news out of the trash to get to hurt people, seems they think that when someone has chosen a path others dont understand, he/she gets to hear it over and over again... so best get those miss-steps buried and look more what the artist accomplishes to create on the screen with that fractal program and equivalents have a nice week Harmen