In looking back on my post to this thread, it occurs to me that the first paragraph in it was awfully mean-spirited and I think an apology is in order (and, no, I wasn't told to do this - conscience...) to the people who try to help others learn Apop. I've had people help me in the past, too, and other than the bit of natural self satisfaction they may have felt, I'm sure they only meant well and to be helpful and friendly. I'm sorry to have flown off the handle with that dreck. No excuses. This is all a very touchy subject in light of recent events. I do stick with the second part. Though, maybe as the Apop software is becoming expanded, there will be more varied possiblilities. Avram