""One of two another programs :-)" Okay here a real little list and for sure not complete Chaoscope ,Vision of Chaos,ChaosPro,FractVizion,LS systems, Strange attractor, 3d landsape toolinside FE and a few programs special for the Mac and then all the Qaurtinion tools and i am sure this a little top of the ice nountain So maybe you can create a apart section for UF and Apo LOL Cheers Arend