For what it's worth, you don't have to plug the gather node into the ambient channel. Alt. diffuse or alt. specular work just as well. You get some interesting results plugging it into the bump or displacement channels, too... :) By using the alt. diffuse/spec channels, you don't have to remember the whole thing about changing the ambient settings - both channels automatically set themselves to white when you plug anything into them. Of course, if you're being complicated in your material setup, and already have nodes plugged into the alt channels, then maybe ambient IS the better course of action. But it's nice to know there are alternatives; if you have a blocked node, then you can always chuck it in somewhere else... jonthecelt