Tim, good to hear from you. "apophobe" made me smile. That's another one of those "P" words, isn't it?

Joel, thanks for jumping in. You and the others that you mentioned certainly have my attention. Like I said, you all are proof that there is much more to apo than a random batches and mindless triangle tweaking.

It looks like we have established that you need a brain to use apo. Cool.

I still believe that the way to most properly use apo is to find flames and move them into UF. I have avoided the newer versions because they didn't work with UF, which means that I didn't take the time to learn about the new capabilities. I know a little more about it now, but I still hate not being able to move flames into UF. Every standalone apo flame that I create looks unfinished to me and I am totally frustated that I can't finish the job in UF.

This has been a great thread so far. Even if it is the same old thing, the counter says that 570 of you have been interested in reading it. Thanks for jumping in

Keith