Actually Daz dropped P4 requirements and there was a rejoicing in the PA community. I'd much prefer doing something fancy with a shader, then create P4 mats and rsr files.

Annibel: PCs keep dropping in price. I just checked the black friday ads, and some places have $10 Pcs probably more advanced then someting from 3 years ago. And a dual core 64 bit system can be had for s little at $500, and that includeds a flat panel monitor 1 gig of ram, AND a ink jet printer (and a free upgrade to windows Vista in January!)

I just don't buy the "computers are too expensive to upgrade" bit any more, because if you look at how much more you get for so little money, PC are an unbelievable value today, compared with 10 or even 20 years ago.

Compare them with anything else in your house price wise, and look at how many hours you use them VS the money you spend.

Example: the latest "hot DVD release. $20 You watch it maybe 3 times in the first year. So figure 2 hours long, 6 hours, $3.33 an hour to own it.

Now we'll look at a cheap PC.. $600. You use it say, 1.5 hours a night average (and that's pretty low)  At the end of the same year, that PC cost you only $1.10 cents an hour to own, or a third LESS (value wise)  then buying DVDs!

Now factor in how much extra tme you spend on an old pc compared with a newer faster PC, and then add in the additional new features newer PCs have compared to older ones, and the value just gets better and better.

If a decent PC still cost $4000, I would agree with the cost argument, but with the continual price war, and constant speed and hardware imporvements, upgrading your PC every few years is just one of the best value things you can do with your money.

Way too many people take way too many things way too seriously.