Ahhh, trillium36's great work! RICHARD, I believe that you can go to her own web page and ask her for a model in Vue file format. Here's the link to her web page. http://www.trillium36.com/Botanical/Botanical.htm You'll find a place at the bottom of the main page where you can send her an e-mail. She used to sell her work here on Renderosity too, so you might look around here a bit. And, if not, ... she did use an older version of MAX, so I suspect that I could convert the files for you, should you have to purchase them at Squid. I have purchased many of her plants in the past, before I learned how to model myself. I never experienced any problems in converting her models from one format to another. They are made in very high quality fashion. You'll like these. (And by the way, I think you only need one of these - not both.) Anyhow, try sending her a note. Also, keep in mind that all the model-builders hanging out at Cornucopia3D keep a sharp on on the "What's On Your Wishlist?" thread there. About 90% of the "wishes" have been fulfilled - one of us usually picks these wishes up and makes the desired models. But trillium's work is wonderful. Go take a try at writing her a request for a Vue formatted bird-of-paradise, first.