Forum: Poser - OFFICIAL


Subject: OT? -- Poser insulted at 3DBuzz, I decided not to let it pass

operaguy opened this issue on May 14, 2007 · 242 posts


Zarat posted Tue, 15 May 2007 at 1:47 AM

That's some interesting way to react to Poser or the art created with it's help.
If I look at the 3D app related talking in work there is no looking down to the artists that can only do nice colorful models and animations of products or illustrations for theories while the scientists and engineers have to work many months without much more then a bunch of numbers as a result.
There's some bitching about to creative artists sometimes and some sort of fights over time at  specific computing hardware but that's some work related issue that can't be applied for hobbyists.

Someone who creates a model or scene from scratch and uses photographies for textures has of course more work than someone who loads a model and some texture with a mouseclick.
The important point is that both methods are nothing more than work.
Different amounts of work but nothing artistic so far.
There is no logic behind the statement that placing some points in some virtual space is art.
There is no logic behind the statement that building complex shaders with DarkTree or Poser or whatever is art.
There is no logic behind stating that pressing a button of some camera or pressing some buttons on some musical instruments is art.There is also no logic behind the statement that using some brush with some color on some canvas is art.

Art can only be found in the result of such processes.
A process is not related to art and a process engineer is no artist.
Neither the process of creation, the result nor the interval from before creation to it's end are  necessarily related to art.

Building an highway is work, modeling work, that does not lead to artistic expressions in landscapes.
What some viewer thinks and feels about this highway is relevant to estimate the highway's artistic value. The result can not be absolute.
Mixing worth with work is not rational.

The most likely cause to see one's own work as superior - in whatever way - over the work done by someone else with different tools is the inability to analyze what was done and what is the whole state of the viewed matter. (I don't mean if something is finished; that is never the case with anything. It's the state of the specific matter to the whole)
The amount of work is not a part of the set of art. It can be related to art but it never is a native part of the set. At least in mathematical logic.

The next reason for people mixing up art with work: they fail to see the set and what is part of it. They maybe feel better if they exclude this truth.
It's not nice to realize after maybe two weeks of modeling and shader work that all that is left is a damn single room and still dozens of errors. It alleviates the pain if one can include all the hard work in the resulting artwork.
It could be even worse if this person is a decent modeler that can with some precision depict what real world allows to exist and what nature created before him.
Maybe this person went to great lenghts to gather information about all the details of the object he wants to model. The person traveled to somewhere to take reference pictures, learned the used modeling app somewhat better to realize the wanted attributes and went then to model the object for some long time.
The resulting picture maybe shows nothing more than some rare physical effect. It's not art, but a somewhat precise depiction of reality.
Now a Poser user comes and clicks the library tab to load the figure that was made out before mentioned model and does some fancy renders with it...
And quite some people praise this persons artistic skills for the creative usage of someone's else model and textures...
To make it even worse the original creator get's a single line of credit that many will not even read and many other will have forgotten 5 minutes later.

Now there's another point why some Persons believe their 3D apps make them superior.
The only appreciation they get is that their chosen 3D app doesn't crash or that it doesn't react with error messages on the user's actions. A hobbyist will not get paid for his effort of learning any 3D app or achieving whatever horrible or good results with it. The only useful reciprocal exchange is that of appreciation by the viewers of this persons (art)work.
Now the up-dressers could endanger this source of appreciation that other human viewers are because they get it for much less work and this on less time. And human viewers usually prefer an steady input, like from some Poser user, over that sporadic and hard to estimate input of an serious modeler.

BTW, there's sometimes a similar behaviour between scientists and engineers and scientists and hobbyists. Science aims for precision while engineering can be done solely on approximations as long as the goal will be reached. For the reason of sacrificing precision of real world functionality sometimes a scientist looks down on an engineer. While a scientist often has to study longer and more, it doesn't always enable him to create some device.
But it's also common that for example an chemist tells his chemical engineers what to do or what is OK. Physicists can be even worse due to the broad spectrum they studied about.