Forum: Poser - OFFICIAL


Subject: I need data, from You.

Un_authorized opened this issue on Jul 22, 2007 · 36 posts


Un_authorized posted Mon, 23 July 2007 at 9:21 AM

Thank you! I've been wanting to see these for quite awhile. I'll answer them each in turn (though admittedly I'll have to type fast.. need to be getting ready for work soon).

Quote - Is there a possibility that Daddy (or whoever) may yank back the space and bandwidth once this thing really gets going? Is the owner of the web-hosting company aware of just how big this could get? In my time as a COBOL mainframe programmer, I've heard of people running side businesses off 3 am mainframe idle times. They'd typically get found out and
have their datasets erased, screwing not only them, but also all their
"clients." Now I know you are talking about helping hobbists and not
businesses, but hobbist spend money too, and also their time (which is money too). 

The site space is courtesy of my sister, who owns the company. She's been in business for five years now... considering the tons of work I've put in to help her get the servers up and running, I'm sure it won't get pulled anytime soon. If this thing begins to really grow, I already know of and have basic pricing structures for larger hosting services that are still within realistic budgets. If it gets really large, then I know of at least two datacenters that I can turn to locally, with full SLA and space to spare.

Quote - One of the reasons the major communities are more businesses then communities is that running and supporting a website (with real support personnel)
really does cost money even while also factoring in the profit motive.

I agree, perfectly.

Quote -
However noble your intentions are regarding having a site that is not distorted by
the profit motive, I think you will still run into the money question. Your operations will still have to support themselves somehow, so the most you will be doing is having an operation that's distorted by money in a different way than the operations that currently exist. As you have said "They have to have that focus, or they would die." Once you have the information you need, you will need to make clear how your new site will support itself.  The more likely your site is to
survive, the more likely it is that it will attract the interest you need to make it worthwhile.

I've been thinking about this as well. When I originally wrote the post, I had figured initially that I could set up discreet banner ads and use the revenue to support the site. If things get too big, I will have to find other means to support costs, but you are right in that those means must be communicated clearly to everyone. In my professional life, I state my biases up-front when asked to recommend something, and have found that such honesty is very refreshing to those who hear it. Not thaat I'm some sort of great orator, but that there are no hidden motives or angles.

"I think it would be cool to have a shopping guide, based on value, price, and based on actual unbiased experiences."

  > Quote - I think that would be an excellent ideal, if you could pull it off. The problem would be the cost of gathering all that data to get it in one place. I created an earlier thread (www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php) in which I floated the idea of creating a wiki-fyed database of all the 3D objects that were available, freebie or costie. I also had the idea that this user supported database (which is what I meant by wiki) could also be a collection point for requests for non-existent objects so that independent creators could see the demand for a given kind of object and meet the demand. I was presented with the fact that www.whatever3d.com/, mystic-nights.com/directory/index.php, www.sam3d.com/, and

poserpoorhouse.pbwiki.com/ were all doing this very thing. And for all I know, they may be passing search terms with zero results on to the vendors in some fashion. (Someone made a suggestion here that Rendo's zero-result search terms be handed over to the marketing dept).

I've not seen these offhand, but I will read them today when I get the chance. I am grateful to see that you've already gone to the trouble of researching much of it in public.

Quote - The only thing I see that you want to do different is add independent customer satisfaction reviews to the database. More power to you if you can get people interested in doing that. (And make sure you have good moderators or good liability insurance. Ditto for the forums idea. [Did you see the TamelaJ thread?])

I have set up and moderated a couple of forums before - and reviews are something I am very interested in. If someone gets offended enough to start spending time and money on a lawyer, then they would have to really go out of their way to find something to win from, and in most cases it would cost them far, far more than it would cost me. That said, I will be speaking with a lawyer long before I formulate and set up guidelines for reviews. I know a couple of them that owe me some time. :)

Quote - "Tutorials rock" Well sorted-out tutorials? Video tutorials? Excellent idea. Little liability in that that I can see. The problem that you are looking at a massive database reorganization. There are a lot of tutorials out there. I thought my wiki-db idea might eventually include things like tutorials as well.  But problem is the cost of having some actual people shuffling the data around.  Even charites pay good money to massage and shuffle data around.

Depends on how they're organized. I've found that 90% of the headache and heartaches in data management is the initial structure itself. Much of the data-shoveling can be accomplished by the submitter as well, if it's done with a clear and logical structure.

Quote - "I think a tiered (or differentiated) gallery would be cool:" Have you looked at the complaints about how galleries are rated? (Here, there, or anywhere?) You would inherit all those complaints. Are you ready for that? Do you have the stomach for it? 

Yes.

I've seen the Hot 20 (and remember well Legume's demonstration of how easily it could be shattered). I have even formulated alternate systems. This is something still being worked on (that is, how exactly to approach it).

  > Quote - "News?" Now here might be the best place to start. News put out by any organization that needs to make money nearly always has an ulterior motive. I can see where  reporting that is vendor-free and cross-community might be useful and welcome. But I'm too new here to know if such news sources already exist.  And again, liability insurance. (You do not have to be in the wrong to go wrong. There are such things as "slap" suits.)

Agreed. Cross-community news is almost non-existent. Then again, this hasn't hurt Tom's Hardware, HEXUS, or the plethora of other hardware news and review sites any. A good up-front policy goes a long way towards reducing the chance of any relevant lawsuits. :)

Quote - I second, third and forth the mega-FAQS idea. Should one come into existence, I recommend that the HTML link to it be in 72 point type with flashing yellow and red colors.  Once Rendo's Poser FAQS is updated, I recommend that for it as well. This might also be a good place to start.

Definitely! I've lost count long ago of how many people keep asking what even the basic terms mean, or newbies who get lost at the mere mention of bits and bobs that they cannot wrap their heads around without knowing the terminology (or even the slang).

Quote - We recently had a discussion about the fact that some vendor's items get kicked out of the market place if they don't generate a certain amount of money in a certain amount of time.  Some of these items are really good things that simply need more time to find their markets. One unique service you could provide would be to provide a home for such "long-tail" items.

You know? That wouldn't be a half-bad idea at all. As much as I detest the idea of running a store, the biggest part of that stems from two things, one being the fad/fashion portion, the other being the "flea market" aspect, where you have to dig through a mountain of, well, crap, to get to the quality stuff.

Quote - Well, that sounds overall like a negative post. I don't mean it to be, or to attack you or knock your enthusiasm for assisting 3D art.  Its just that Thomas Edison had it right when he said everything is "1% inspiration and 99% perspiration." Having wonderful ideas is one thing. Getting other people to fall in with you in executing them is a whole other ball of wax.

It isn't negative, it's reality.

I don't intend to do it alone, either. Once the site is near enough to completion on mission, goals, and framework, I intend to do some recruiting. Hopefully I can find some talented, level-headed, and eager volunteers (I'm not doing this for pay either, at least not until/unless it really takes off, then I start hiring from among those volunteers who helped out at the start).

Cheers!