hey thats great, thankyou! big s :D actually I was just thinking about the eyes, how earlier in another thread we were saying the eyes are what seems to be different in Final Fantasy and Poser(max). Something I might try myself when I get the chance is to give the eyewhites an extrememely slight amount of self illumination, cause when I look at my eyes in quite a few different lighting situations the eye whites dont have that much shadow. I mean there is still shadow but it is very faint and has quite a bit of falloff and they are very moist looking. Just something I might try out and see.