Quote - And quite frankly, right now, this very instant, you yourself are coming across as one of those uncaring, "me above all" SOBs who create and manipulate these situations solely for personal advantage.

Oh c'mon. Who do you think you're talking to? I'm about as modest in terms of lifestyle as a US citizen can get. I am unemployed (the only reason I have time for this), semi-disabled, but don't qualify for benefits, don't own even a car, and have virtually no assets to speak of. I am the proverbial turnip it is so hard to get blood out of. There's no need to try to demonize me or turn me into an enemy. We are in agreement on much more than you apparently think.

I was just pointing out a couple of areas in which I felt you were making some very broad generalizations. It was you, not I, who equated venture capitalists pulling their money out of the internet as being the equivalent of commodity trading, and you, not I, who neglected to mention that much of the collapse of the tech stocks and speculation in the real estate markets was due to ordinary investors (i.e., retirees, etc.) putting their money into the hands of financial advisers and telling them to make them as much money as reasonable risk allows, and it was you, not I, who -- at the start of this discussion, and since -- seemed to be insisting that the oil industry hasn't much financial interest in terms of the cost of oil or gas or (apparently) anything else.

IMHO, nothing is quite as simple as you insist. Government doesn't act in a vacuum. Corporate interests often do influence, and often do benefit from, war making. Taxpayers do usually pay the bills. Investors, big and small -- like people do in just about every other field of human endeavor I am aware of -- often do follow the leader like sheep to the slaughter.

And while you are big on criticism, and saying this and that shouldn't be, it sounds almost as if you are saying people shouldn't do these things because, well, people shouldn't do these things, well, 'cause it's not right. Okay. But since when does that kind of argument hold any sway over human behavior? I haven't heard much in the way of solutions -- unless you think locking away a bunch of folks for "crimes against humanity" is really a solution.

Personally, there are only a few things I can think of right now that might improve things.

One might be to get commercial bankers out of the speculation biz. To me, that seems to be one of the problems. When Phil Gramm got rid of much of the wall between commercial and investment banking, it seems to me, some of what we've seen since is the result -- and not just making risky variable rate mortgage loans to home-buyers, but deregulating things to the point of putting commercial banks in the biz of taking a lot of other extra risks.

What else? I don't know. Tighter regulations on how much corporations are allowed to influence and write their own regulatory legislation? Disallowing folks from constantly moving back and forth between corporate contractors and the government agencies that oversee and award their contracts? Public financing of political campaigns? Closer monitoring of the investment industry? Enforcement of anti-trust laws or some kind of limits on the accumulation of personal and/or corporate assets? Force corporations to dissolve upon the deaths of their founders? Force political parties to dissolve after every election?

What? What? How radical shall we get? If you have any ideas, any at all that don't involve hauling a bunch of people into court to be tried for crimes against humanity, I'm listening.

And as for blaming the blithering idiot in the White House, that's just fine by me. I blame him, too. Plenty. Let's just not pretend he is anything more than a tool, and a tool of ... what particular interests ... do you think ... ? (Any chance he might be a tool of some of the same interests that have been influencing US policy for several decades now?, let's see, y'know, like all those folks who do not profit in any way from higher oil and gas prices?, and, er, certainly don't profit in any other way from US war making? Or how about just a tool of the same ol' American people at large who, when economic times are shaky, almost always seem to vote their pocket books no matter what the potential ramifications may turn out to be?)